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Topic: Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature
Posted by: David Ainsworth
Date/Time: 09/12/24 20:05:00

"Hamas caused the predictable wrath that arose from that fowl up."

I don't think that Hamas thought that the massacre "would bring in all the other Arab nations to attack Israel." I think that would seem unlikely to Hamas. Of which of all the Arab nations were you thinking? For Israel, there have been peace treaties, tacit agreements and normalization of relations with quite a few.

I think that Hamas expected a harsh response from Israel, which is what happened, although it still may have have exceeded Hamas' expectations. On the whole, Israel's year-long destruction in Gaza has destroyed much of the sympathy and support which the October 7th massacre had created for her in the world community.

Worth reading:-

"The Lessons and Legacy of October 7"
Oct 2, 2024
Richard Haass.

"It is possible to win a war on the battlefield and still lose it. Israel has done precisely that in Gaza, by choosing to fight a conventional war against an unconventional foe without a plan for what comes next."

"The legacy – or more accurately legacies – of October 7 provide little ground for optimism. A two-state solution is more distant than ever. Such an approach was already a long shot before October 7, but the last year has reinforced Israelis’ doubt about the desirability and possibility of living safely alongside an independent Palestinian state. At the same time, Israel’s response to October 7 has strengthened anti-Israel views among Palestinians in Gaza, the West Bank, and Israel proper, and strengthened the appeal of Hamas, which, like its backers in Iran, has no interest in peaceful coexistence with Israel.

The net result is that the future is likely to resemble a “one-state non-solution”: Israeli control of the territory between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River, an expanding settler population, and frequent clashes between Israeli security forces and Hamas in Gaza and with Hamas-like militias in the West Bank.

Israel has lost a great deal, not just in lives and economic output, but in reputation and standing in the United States and the world. A younger generation sees Israel more as Goliath than David, more oppressor than oppressed. Anti-Semitism has spiked. And with prospects for a two-state solution all but dead, Israel could well face a binary choice between being a Jewish state and a democratic one. The weakening of Hezbollah and the Houthis, however welcome, does not alter these realities.

Israel has also paid a price in the region. Iran has achieved what may have been one of its original goals for the attack: making it more difficult for Saudi Arabia, a powerful force in the Arab and Islamic worlds, to establish formal diplomatic relations with Israel. Although condemnation of Israel’s actions since October 7 will not prevent intelligence and military cooperation with select Arab governments facing the mutual threat of Iran, the kingdom’s ruler has walked back his openness to normalizing relations in the absence of an independent Palestinian state.

The US has also paid a high price since October 7. It has lost standing in the Arab world for its inability to influence Israeli policy, and has alienated some in Israel with its criticism and independent moves. Moreover, the US finds itself once again deeply involved in the Middle East when its strategic priorities are to deter Chinese aggression in the Asia-Pacific and counter Russian aggression in Europe. All this no doubt brings satisfaction to the anti-Western axis comprising China, Russia, North Korea, and Iran.

None of this was inevitable. Successive Israeli governments chose to weaken the PA and underestimated the threat posed by Hamas, which took advantage by staging its brutal attack. Israel then responded militarily and not at all politically. And the US expended most of its diplomatic capital advocating in vain for a ceasefire that neither protagonist wanted. The human, economic, and diplomatic price has been enormous, and what already was the world’s most troubled region has been left even worse off."

https://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/lessons-and-legacy-of-october-7-for-israel-middle-east-and-us-by-richard-haass-2024-10



Entire Thread
TopicDate PostedPosted By
Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 14:56:00 John Hawkes
   Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 15:54:00 Nicholas Evans
      Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 16:43:00 John Hawkes
         Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 16:56:00 Philippa Bond
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 17:21:00 Steven Rose
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 17:28:00 Philippa Bond
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 17:54:00 Freddie Francis
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 20:05:00 David Ainsworth
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 17:06:00 John Hawkes
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 14:56:00 John Hawkes
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 14:45:00 John Hawkes
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 14:43:00 John Hawkes
         Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 20:02:00 Ed Robinson
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature09/12/24 21:21:00 Steven Rose
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 13:27:00 Philippa Bond
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 17:19:00 John Hawkes
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 17:08:00 John Hawkes
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 17:12:00 Lucille Grant
      Re:Re:Modern day Slavery : Israel does not feature10/12/24 14:38:00 John Hawkes
         Reply10/12/24 17:13:00 Nicholas Evans
            Re:Reply10/12/24 18:01:00 Steven Rose
            Re:Reply11/12/24 10:26:00 John Hawkes

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